edit: after 20 comments, i’m adding a post description here, since most of the commenters so far appear not to be reading the article:

This is about how surprisingly cheap it is (eg $15,000) to buy a complete production line to be able to manufacture batteries with a layer of nearly-undetectable explosives inside of them, which can be triggered by off-the-shelf devices with only their firmware modified.

screenshot of paragraph from the article saying "The process to build such batteries is well understood and documented. Here is an excerpt from one vendor’s site promising to sell the equipment to build batteries in limited quantities (tens-to-hundreds per batch) for as little as $15,000:" followed by a screenshot of "Flow-chart of Pouch Cell Lab-scale Fabrication" showing a 20 step process

  • FarceOfWill@infosec.pubEnglish
    10214·
    3 months ago

    Jfc Christ Lemmy.

    Every single comment misunderstanding the point. The batteries are exploding because there’s explosives in them. This does make them exploding batteries. They explode because they are partially made with explosives. Please don’t “well actually” this.

    No this is not a description of something Israel did, it’s a hypothetical way to do a similar attack to show how within reach of idiot terrorists it is.

    Raising the idea of doing this so everyone is thinking about it is extremely bad for us all. Thanks Israel.

  • Ilovethebomb@lemm.eeEnglish
    668·
    3 months ago

    Just to be clear, the pager thing wasn’t exploding batteries, they had apparently been modified at the production level to have explosives in them, which could be triggered by the pager system itself.

      • breadsmasher@lemmy.worldEnglish
        417·
        3 months ago

        Did you read it?

        The article literally talks about inserting an explosive layer inside the battery at production. Just like the comment said.

        It isn’t “any batteries can explode”.

        Reports indicate the explosive payload in the cells is made of PETN.

        Such a sheet could be inserted into the battery fold-and-stack process, after the first fold is made (or, with some effort, perhaps PETN could be incorporated into the spacer polymer itself – but let’s assume for now it’s just a drop-in sheet, which is easy to execute and likely effective)

        • Arthur Besse@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
          632·
          3 months ago

          Just to be clear, the pager thing wasn’t exploding batteries, they had apparently been modified at the production level to have explosives in them, which could be triggered by the pager system itself.

          What? 🤦 The comment I replied to said:

          Just to be clear, the pager thing wasn’t exploding batteries, they had apparently been modified at the production level to have explosives in them, which could be triggered by the pager system itself.

          It seems clear that “they had apparently been modified at the production level” is referring to the pagers, rather than their batteries. But the article is explaining how it could have been that the batteries were the part of the pager that had the explosives (in which case it was the battery that was exploding).

          • breadsmasher@lemmy.worldEnglish
            302·
            3 months ago

            You are inferring what someone meant, and then applying some super pedantic reasoning.

            When manufacturing pagers, that includes the pager electronics, the case, and the battery.

            Wasn’t exploding batteries

            The batteries themselves unmodified, standard batteries were not somehow hacked to explode. At some point in the manufacturing of the pagers which includes the battery, explosives were included.

            • Arthur Besse@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
              426·
              3 months ago

              You are inferring what someone meant, and then applying some super pedantic reasoning.

              I think I am inferring correctly, especially since the person you’re talking about replied “of course not” to my question about if they read the article.

      • ContrarianTrail@lemm.eeEnglish
        111·
        3 months ago

        Most other people wont be reading it either so I don’t see an issue with pointing out the obvious misconception people could make based on the headline that talks about exploding batteries.

  • RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.worldEnglish
    635·
    3 months ago

    Even though your edit clarified it, I wish we’d stop calling them “exploding batteries”. The battery isn’t the explosive, it’s the explosives that were hidden in the device. I’ve already encountered far too many morons describing conspiracies where the big bad government could make your iPhone explode.

      • Crashumbc@lemmy.worldEnglish
        71·
        3 months ago

        That’s like saying exploding cars when you’re really talking about a bomb placed in a car…

        • surewhynotlem@lemmy.worldEnglish
          37·
          3 months ago

          “A bomb going 80 mph on the highway exploded.”

          Doesn’t give the right information.

          And if we’re being pedantic, when a bomb explodes, so does everything around it. Exploding doesn’t require a chemical reaction. It’s the act of tearing apart quickly. So yes, the car exploded.

          That’s in English though. Other languages may be different.

  • Maggoty@lemmy.worldEnglish
    657·
    3 months ago

    It’s also a big ass war crime. And if you did it habitually as anyone other than the West you could expect a visit from the US military. Inside the West you’d likely end up in prison. Except Israel. Israel is just immune to everything because uhhh… Because… Well nobody actually has a good reason.

  • ashar@infosec.pubEnglish
    587·
    3 months ago

    Sending out IEDs that will probably explode in a supermarket and kill civilians is generally considered a war crime. So far 2 kids killed in Beirut by the Israeli bombs in devices.

    • roofuskit@lemmy.worldEnglish
      285·
      3 months ago

      Exterminating the next generation of people who would live on the land they want to steal is the goal.

  • ryathal@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
    244·
    3 months ago

    We don’t see exploding batteries more because most militaries are better about securing their supply chain.

    • geneva_convenience@lemmy.mlEnglish
      175·
      3 months ago

      The attack hit many civilians. For militaires it might be feasible to secure their chain. For terror attacks, which this was, it would be far more difficult.

    • SoJB@lemmy.mlEnglish
      920·
      3 months ago

      Really glad to hear the dead 8 year old girl was Khamas. I’m sure the dozen children that will be shot in the head today will be relieved once they find out they were Khamas as well and deserved to be shot in the head.

  • Echo Dot@feddit.ukEnglish
    177·
    3 months ago

    And also because it’s impossible.

    So it is actually in fact very hard. What they had was exploding explosives which are not hard.

    • Arthur Besse@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
      1921·
      3 months ago

      Since apparently many people aren’t reading the article: It is about how cheap it actually is (eg $15,000) to buy a complete production line to be able to manufacture batteries with a layer of nearly-undetectable explosives inside of them, which can be triggered by off-the-shelf devices with only their firmware modified.

      screenshot of paragraph from the article saying "The process to build such batteries is well understood and documented. Here is an excerpt from one vendor’s site promising to sell the equipment to build batteries in limited quantities (tens-to-hundreds per batch) for as little as $15,000:" followed by a screenshot of "Flow-chart of Pouch Cell Lab-scale Fabrication" showing a 20 step process

  • tal@lemmy.todayEnglish
    10·
    3 months ago

    Context: bunniestudios.com is run by bunnie, the guy who was involved with the hardware side of breaking DRM on the original XBox; he later went into consumer electronics manufacturing.

  • SlopppyEngineer@lemmy.worldEnglish
    1510·
    3 months ago

    Lithium burns intensely but it doesn’t explode. An electric car can burn for a long time, but they don’t explode. One of the comments says so

    I understand that what happened in Libanon was that dedicated explosives were added to the devices, it was not the batteries exploding. But that does not take away the conclusion of your story.

    It shouldn’t be undetectable. Throw a device from s series into a fire as a spot check and if it burns it’s ok, if it explodes give the entire series to your enemy’s kids to play with.

    • vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zoneEnglish
      213·
      3 months ago

      Throw a device from s series into a fire as a spot check and if it burns it’s ok, if it explodes give the entire series to your enemy’s kids to play with.

      Most high explosives burn unless detonated properly.

      This is really basic stuff. I don’t think you should be out and about giving people advice about handling (potential) explosives.

    • NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
      16·
      3 months ago

      I am not an explosives expert, but I’ve seen enough YouTube videos about explosives to know that not all explosives explode in fire. Some are incredibly stable at extreme conditions right up until deliberately triggered. It all depends on the type of explosives.

      There may still be ways to detect them, but it’s not necessarily going to be that simple.

      • Echo Dot@feddit.ukEnglish
        13·
        3 months ago

        Yes that’s correct high explosives require a starter explosive. However this starter explosive would also have to be incorporated into the device and the starter explosive is triggered by a spark or a fire. So throwing it in a fire would still work as a test you’d just have to make sure it totally melted before concluding anything.

        • Uranium 🟩@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          51·
          3 months ago

          They don’t necessarily require a starter explosive, certain types do of course. It’s more about overcoming the initial energy required, for example the arc from an electric arc lighter could probably overcome that requirement in a lot of scenarios.

          • Echo Dot@feddit.ukEnglish
            1·
            3 months ago

            The type of explosive used in this is not a high explosive. If put in a fire it would have exploded

      • SlopppyEngineer@lemmy.worldEnglish
        21·
        3 months ago

        It’s right next to or in a high intensity lithium fire, not just a normal little flame. That should alter the equation somewhat.

        • ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
          3·
          3 months ago

          It’s possible that it could, but could also not. I’d be curious to find out what would happen but unfortunately the feds won’t let me run tests on semtex because I don’t have “the proper permits.” Jerks.

          Maybe we’ll see someone with a license to manufacture destructive devices, like OrdinanceLab on YT, do a video on it (fingers crossed!)

    • Ilovethebomb@lemm.eeEnglish
      2·
      3 months ago

      It depends on the explosive, C-4, and I think all plastic explosives, will burn in a fire.

  • Blackmist@feddit.ukEnglish
    22·
    3 months ago

    It’s not just the batteries, you need a way to blow them up remotely and reliably.

    This wasn’t just some wonky batteries shoved into legit devices. This was an entire operation to make fake pagers and walkie talkies. The batteries were probably the only legit things in them.

    Fortunately these are simple devices that you can probably replicate the guts of with a few dollars of off the shelf parts. You’re not going to be able to fake an iPhone like this. Cheaper to just drop bombs at that point. And tbh, if it was something expensive like an iPhone, Hezbollah wouldn’t have bought a thousand of them.

  • PenisDuckCuck9001@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
    33·
    3 months ago

    I’m saving this. Not because I want to make bombs, but if it really is that easy to make lithium batteries then knowing about the process will be beneficial someday. It’s hard to find information about how rechargeable batteries work. You probably couldn’t even make a lead acid battery from raw materials using just information on the internet.