If you see something like this and get angry at women, you have a problem.
At best it’s a problem with reading comprehension. At worst, you’re worried that things like this could get in the way of your murdering-women hobby.
Yup, and as a guy, I am not going home with two women that approach me in a bar after I flash some cash. Know your attackers and keep safe from them.
Also dress modestly to make sure you don’t provoke men with your body.
Go away.
The first part is clearly a joke. I hate that I need to clarify this but you never know with the amount of sexist idiots in this thread
Random woman: I like late night walks, but I’m scared for my safety.
This thread for some reason: YOU DON’T THINK MEN GET SCARED? MURDERED!?
Like, chill. Yes, men can absolutely be murdered/hurt walking alone. But are we really going to sit here and act like women are making up their concerns/grievances out of spite? For some reason, if anyone mentions a general concern/issue related to women’s experiences with men, some people trip over themselves to say how it’s actually not an issue and how it’s actually so much worse for men. If I’m listening to a male DV victim and I go, “well, actually, women are more likely to be victims of DV. You know, it’s actually not even an issue for you. Here, look at these numbers that prove that women are the victims. Do you not mention it because you hate women? Why are you trying to ruin our spotless reputation as delicate flowers that can do no wrong with your lies”, you would think I was nuts, and for good reason.
Also men in this thread: THIS IS LITERALLY EXACTLY LIKE RACISM
Are you surprised that a generalising statement evokes emotional responses?
I’m surprised it evokes this level of defensiveness. Isn’t man-on-man crime a problem too? Nothing about the post says men can’t be victims too.
You are 10x more likely to die by falling, car crash or unintentionally poisoned than get murdered.
You are 20x more likely to die by falling, car crash, or unintentionally poisoned than get murdered, as a woman.
Women are actually much less likely to get murdered in general.
Stop villainizing men. This is equally as idiotic as villainizing POC because they have higher crime rates Dont sink to the level of the GOP by generalizing. The unfair alienation of young men is real, and ultimately cost us the election, just so we can feel better than them.
You to the woman taking a cab home after a night at the club: “Ma’am, don’t you know you’re 20x more likely to die by falling, car crash, or unintentional poisoning than being murdered? Why don’t you walk home alone instead of taking the cab?”
“She just got raped, beaten and robbed, that totally isn’t a murder! Women are safer than men!” sheesh, talk about not making a point…
I find these numbers intriguing. Where did you get them from?
From his imagination.
Sure, men are getting killed. But they are not getting killed because of their gender, while women on the other hand are often killed exactly because they are women.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Femicide
So, a woman going out alone in the dark is always at risk of being raped, killed or violated in other ways.
Well I imagine that men get killed more in general. The dude might have a point there. It’s just speculation with no fact the way he wrote it.
But if he is right it would make more sense to get some stats on how many men vs women get attacked, stalked, followed, cat called, etc going about their business at night. My imagination is that those numbers are very different and that they - together with the fact that most women are way weaker than most men - would have a reason to be more afraid.
“more men get murdered” isn’t relevant though. Hypothetically, if predominantly men murder lots of men and women equally, a woman would be right to be worried about getting murdered by a man.
Unintentional deaths https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/accidental-injury.htm
Homicide statistics https://www.statista.com/statistics/1388777/murder-victims-in-the-us-by-gender/
I dont understand why people are so offended by my comment. Why blame a whole demographic by something committed by 0.02% of them? Why are so people so intent on such blame? It accomplishes less than nothing, it just antagonizes the group you are attempting to reach.
Because it happens enough to be a problem. Mexicans are also more likely to die from any of those things than from cartel violence so I guess cartels are not a problem? I’m gonna assume you suck at statistics, because the alternative is that you’re sexist.
You’re a dumbass. Stop gaslighting women. /A man
My god, I am a cis male and I don’t feel threatened or targeted by this. I think there’s a reason why certain men feel attacked.
I should have expected to see a bunch of whining when I opened the thread.
I’m also cis male and I am worried about strange men coming near me at night when no one is around. Because, you know, muggers and shit. They murder sometimes too. Does that make you whiny little bitches’ hurt feelings go away?
Yup, and we are less likely to be targeted. Also, not a whole lot of women out there murdering around town at night.
My brother is a cis male too, he was assaulted and robbed, by two males (at least seemingly so, can’t exactly say what they identify as 6 years later).
Just a bunch of males who only complain about the statistics of men being harmed when women talk about systemtic sexism. They’d probably also loudly claim that white people are victims of racism too when a black people talks about being harassed by cops.
Fucking hate Reddit 2.0 for this shit.
Well I was just called a bigot for daring to say that calling quoting the statistic that men commit more murders than women sexism is no different from calling quoting the statistic that most crimes in Sweden are committed by white people racism. So there’s no probably about it in my mind.
Same people will gladly hurl slurs and sexist remarks then call it misandry when a woman said she doesn’t need a man with a dildo, or reverse racism when a black person said they enjoy spices in their meals.
Heaven forbid that woman say she doesn’t need a man because there are other women.
Because you are solipsistic & are desperate to get into the pants of a woman, that’s why
Don’t need to, yo momma already lets me in nightly 😎
tfw you can’t see women as anything other than sex objects and you just assume everyone else is like you
That’s rich coming a person that wants to demonize men (Oh & BTW, who told Women to make an OnlyFans ?? Not men)
Slut shaming too? You are being impolite.
onlyfans supplies the demand coming from men what the fuck are you talking about
also most women don’t even fucking have an onlyfans you dumbass. why do incels always insert that into every conversation? what the hell is going on with you guys?
Reading the comments make me feel like I’m reading 4chan. How are people getting triggered by that post
It’s literally engagement bait gender wars bullshit. This conversation is fucking useless until you start asking WHY and none of them do, they just start throwing bullshit around about their own personal anecdotes or start screaming “NO THATS NOT TRUE” “YES IT IS”
It’s a useless never ending “debate”. Man vs. Bear should’ve taught us that. Mods should’ve locked the post or deleted it already IMO.
One of the mods posted this
Enacting change is not the point of the post, it’s just a woman making a joke about the way she experiences life to others who may experience life in the same way. Men just got their feelings hurt and now, instead of trying to prove they’re not sexist, they’re in full denial about the rampant oppression women live every day.
I’m gonna bring this thread up the next time people throw a tantrum when I say Lemmy is sexist.
Lemmy.world moment
Reddit is 4chan with account, .world is trying to be reddit 2.0 by it’s admins, not a shock.
A healthy take that will surely result in good faith discussion.
lemmy.world mods finding out that they’ve cultivated a community of reddit incels:
When the Reddit 2.0 copies all the worst parts of Reddit: 🤯
This from a user on an instance that’s known for their open villification of any opinion that goes against the moscow and beijing dictated groupthi–
Wait, wait hold on. Could it possibly be that we both have deeply subjective views of the other large instances, because humans fall to tribalism faster than a kitten on a sock full of catnip? Maybe there’s a vested interest on every side to keep the early adopters of a decentralized social media platform infighting over meaningless stereotypes based on the letters that come after their username, making value judgements based entirely on dictated preconceptions instead of experiential conclusions and honest interaction?
… nah, probably not. And besides, it’s way more fun to just sling mud. Screw u, u commie scuzbucket.
SJW here and I just wandered in, but now I’m grabbing the popcorn and a seat
Could it possibly be that we both have deeply subjective views of the other large instances, because humans fall to tribalism faster than a kitten on a sock full of catnip?
nope, it’s because your instance is operated by people who refuse to moderate disinformation under some naive belief that enough debate bro-ing is all it takes to defeat it, failing to understand that the effort it takes to proliferate hate and disinformation is much smaller than the effort it takes to refute it. as such, lemmy.world is becoming overrun with some of the most toxic motherfuckers on the entire platform because all the sane people are being driven away.
Ah, a blanket denial of everything I said. How glad I am that I’m above petty things like pointing out the comically stereotypical behavior of users from other instances. It’s nice up here, on the Mountain of Sarcastic Moral Superiority.
As an actual counterpoint, the primary way that new users get onto lemmy is always going to have the highest concentration of toxic users. Society is, if you haven’t noticed, incredibly toxic. Commonly espoused ideas like trans people being human or civil rights being important aren’t commonly supported by society at large (source: the entire world right now). The easiest way for people who support those things to find their way to instances where those ideas are popularly held is to join the most popular instance and see both the need for other instances with heavier moderation, and what those instances are. How many people hear about blahaj or sh.itjust.works before signing up to lemmy, vs. sign up there as their second account? Personally, I’m pretty grateful that the most toxic opinions are largely self-segregated into a place where people aren’t required to interact with them. It’s less pleasant, sure, but it’s also the best place in the fediverse to get an accurate idea of what the real societal opinions are. And if it gets to be too much, I can always just flee .world (or .ml, I mean seriously guys) like a base coward and spend time under one of my alt accounts on a more heavily moderated instance like .blahaj instead.
that isn’t necessarily true though: you don’t see other popular instances of fediverse platforms having these problems when they actually put effort into enforcing rules that protect the community and discourage disinformation and hate speech, and it doesn’t make them any less of a gateway for new users.
the staff on lemmy.world promote disinformation, and that does not benefit any of us, especially when disinformation has a way of spreading that the separation of instances alone isn’t enough to prevent. most are still either directly federated to lemmy.world, or federated to instances that are federated to lemmy.world.
toxicity itself isn’t inherent to society but a consequence of how our current society is set up, and social media platforms that deliberately proliferate disinformation play a role in that. if you want to actually counter hate and disinformation the first step you should take is to stop outright encouraging it and fight it at the source.
also, implying people are cowards for wanting to flee your hate instance is despicable and privileged-ass take. fuck you.
also, implying people are cowards for wanting to flee your hate instance is despicable and privileged ass-take. fuck you.
That was pretty clearly self deprecating. Who in the hell calls someone else a ‘base coward’, anyways? For that matter, who would even take seriously being called a base coward? I think you might genuinely be treating everyone else as hostile as a means of self defense, which while understandable is in itself incredibly (edit: exhausting is a much better term) to interact with.
I have real comments here, along the lines of what you mean by promoting disinformation and the moderation standards you would prefer to see, because those are sincerely interesting. But come on, what’s the point in trying to have a discussion when you treat everything like an attack on you & yours? I’m not even trying to be hostile here.
it’s self-deprecating but has hostile implications toward the many users who really did leave to escape ill treatment toward them. marginalized people get enough of that in real life after all. i don’t think they should have to endure it at all, nor do i think it’s cowardly to want to avoid it. if i’m reading too much into this and that wasn’t your intention, i’m sorry. though i’m really not sure how else to interpret that.
when i say lemmy.world promotes disinformation, i’m referring to their recent announcement that they would require community moderators to entertain disinformation in the name of having open debate. they redacted that announcement following the backlash if i recall correctly, but it is nonetheless reflective of how they have been moderating things on their instance, which is apparent in threads like this one that stir the pot and bring out all the rabid misogynists that have been tolerated and continue to be tolerated on here. the lack of moderation toward these things aligns with what they stated in that announcement, that these are ideas we should be open and fair to.
the problem of course is that being open to disinformation alienates the marginalized people affected by it, harms the people who would be deceived by it, and only serves to benefit the people who would spread it. it’s a lot easier to fight disinformation and bigotry by stopping it at the source rather than letting it fester and then trying to take it down with debate. we all know how difficult it is to argue in good faith against those arguing in bad faith. it takes no time and no effort to just make something up, but more time and effort than most people even have the energy to give to refute it with fact-based evidence.
we’re in the midst of a social crisis with the rise of the incel movement and MRA influencers. those who follow these things are more emotionally invested in them than logically, and near impossible to get through to. you might be able to convince a few undecided readers if you put sufficient effort into your replies, but ultimately the spread of these movements are much faster than the handful of individuals who make an effort to stand against them. a lot of us just don’t even have the time. we need support from those who are in the position to actually take preventive measures against them.
This from a user on an instance that’s known for having a large amounts of transphobic, homophobic, misogynist and racists users and a mod team that doesnt do the bare minimun to deal with them
Where are you going where you see that much of it?
… Then why are you here, participating with that which you revile?
because unfortunately lemmy.ml federates with lemmy.world. even if we were to block lemmy.world on an individual level, the toxicity and hate coming from it affects and influences users of other instances. better to push back against you dweebs whenever you try to incite misogynistic hate than just cover our ears and pretend you aren’t here fucking things up.
Oh good, we agree then. There’s a certain necessity to engage with opinions counter to our own instead of pretending they don’t exist, even if it’s personally uncomfortable to do so.
i counter them out of necessity, but ideally i’d rather the lemmy.world admins do that since that’s supposed to be what they’re for.
So you’d prefer the admins allow you to pretend they don’t exist? I know that’s not what you’re trying to say, but its not an unreasonable extrapolation of your position from the comments you’re making. You feel the need to fight for what you believe in because it’s right to stand up for what you believe in, but you would rather you didn’t have to. I think that’s probably the most universally agreeable statement I’ve ever heard, sincerely. I would, too, like for this to be the case. We just disagree on how to achieve that happy state of affairs, though it’s nice that neither of us prefers a solution like “round up all the .ml/.world users in a big camp” unlike, you know, real world opinions…
Get your pet bear to walk you!
Oh cool we’re back in … 2010? and we’re doing FBI crime stats discourse again, except this time we’re doing the breakdown by gender instead of race.
The world would be a better place without us. I feel ashamed for existing.
Stop murdering women and you’ll be fine
How is this not bigotry and discrimination toward a group of population?
I’ve seen the same post in far right groups just changing the word man by some racial slur. Same energy. And also same bigots trying to justify their intolerance with shitty statistics.
How is this not bigotry and discrimination toward a group of population?
I don’t know about discrimination but definitely bigotry and stupidity.
Because men are statistically more likely to commit violent crimes. Targeting both men and women. Women are just easier targets because they are physically weaker.
Yeah, I’ve heard the “they statistically commit more crimes” elsewhere. Same vibes.
Because men are statistically more likely to commit violent crimes.
So you’re saying it’s ok to make negative statements about a subset of people as long as they are statistically more likely to commit violent crimes?
Men violence towards women is a result of systemic oppression. Stop trying to make social comentary when you understand jackshit about society.
You are not the victim, you’re just playing one to justify your sexism, misogynistic prick.
in some places people of certain skincolors or descents are more likely to commit certain crimes so that’s not really an argument.
The better argument IMO is that the racist versions target discriminated minority groups, while this one targets the group that is generally not the victim
lol
lmao, even.
What and guys aren’t worried about being murdered by other dudes at night? Lol
Statistically men are more likely to be attacked, robbed, sexually assaulted (in a public institution) and shot than women.
Men are more likely to be murdered in general.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/423245/us-violent-crime-victims-by-gender/
Violent crimes happen to men more than women on average.
I am a HUGE advocate for women staying safe. I think more women need to purchase and properly learn how to use a personal high speed lead slinging device.
HOWEVER I do not care for this claim that women are always the victims. Statistically they aren’t more frequently attacked or murdered. In fact they are slightly less likely to be victims. Bad people are gonna do bad things and everyone should learn to protect themselves against those bad people.
DOUBLE HOWEVER Men are overwhelming the perpetrator of violent crimes against everyone. More than 75% of violent crimes is committed by men.
At the end of the day everyone should stay safe. Keep your head on a swivel. Obtain and learn how to use a personal defense tool. Be smart.
That’s a lot of not making a point. The girl in the OP is still worried about walking at night and the most common threat to a woman in that situation is still men. You didn’t counterpoint any of that, so it is just you shouting into the wind about stuff no one is talking about. Cool.
What those statistics do not take into account is the different incidence rates of men/women being out alone at night.
Because women feel more afraid going out into the dark alone, they’re less likely to do so, creating less opportunities for them to be robbed/raped/killed.
To make an analogy:
What are my chances to drown in the sea if I never go swimming in the sea? 0% chance.
What if I go swimming once a week, with a risk of drowning of 0.5% each time I do so: then there’s ~23% chance that I’ll drown by the end of the year.
What if go swimming twice a year, but because I’m such an amateur the chance that I drown is 5%: there is ~10% chance that I drown by the end of the year.Conclusion: even though it is 10x more dangerous for the inexperienced swimmer to go swimming in the sea, in a given year the experienced swimmer is still 2.3 times more likely to drown in the sea than the inexperienced one.
I routinely would go on long walks at all hours of the night (like 3am), with headphones on. Ive done this in the US, Brazil, and Europe in all kinds of neighborhoods. I was a 180lb male and I somewhat consciously and subconsciously would put on the lunatic vibe of “I am the one who knocks”.
Now I started my transition, down to 150 lbs, dressing more feminine. Still have a decent amount of muscle but Truuust me, the vibe is not the same. This meme is valid.
I do not care for this claim that women are always the victims.
who said this?
honest query. I don’t see it in OP’s statement. You do corroborate their premise -
Men are overwhelming the perpetrator of violent crimes against everyone. More than 75% of violent crimes is committed by men.
so why the strawman argument at the start?
You said this, this entire thread
I personally have mad bo staff skills. I fear no man. Grizzly’s scare me, but no man.
Forget about it, there’s no talking or reasoning with man-haters
It’s going to be fun when the GenderKKK attacks these male-feminists, because they’re men
You write like you are disagreeing with something in this post, in your own small pathetic way. But I fail to see what part of the post you are disagreeing with
I wonder if the murder rates are skewed by organized crime/gangs. That has a male skewed gender ratio and high murder rates.
Gangs drive murder rates. Looking at areas in the US without gang activity, the murder rate is almost as low anywhere else in the world.
Almost certainly.
Unfortunately it’s very difficult to pull apart big data sets accurately. It’s difficult to pin down what murders are for sure gang related and which ones aren’t. Obviously there are some situations where it’s very clear, but some where it is not. Where you draw that line changes things significantly.
Unfortunately it’s very difficult to pull apart big data sets accurately
The actual fuck? It’s significantly easier to pull apart large data sets, especially to answer demographic questions like this. This is literally Data Science 101, you’re just making shit up!
They’re not interested in evidence or discussions
It’s a hate-movement
almost certainly
This does not jive with the tenor of your first comment which tries to equate violence against women with violence against men.
Did we read the same comment? He was pointing out statistics around males, not downplaying the statistics around women.
Isn’t it interesting how whenever women come up someone has to rush to point out men as victims, as if to talk about women detracts from that?
Curious.
He’s just making stuff up anyway. It’s not difficult to pull apart those data sets. The information is readily available. It just doesn’t show the first thing that came out of his mouth is correct.
Wow. That is a whole lot of getting your undies in a wad over a meme that does NOT exclude any gender feeling this way.
You brought a bunch of bias to this one. Might want to look into why that is
username checks out
I dunno feels to me like you’re the one getting upset about his post and not vice versa.
So of the photo was of a man, bit with the same text it would be ok. Right? Both you, me, and the woman in the photo agree that men are the problem.
“Not all men” agreed, but enough to men to make others afraid.
True. The caption doesn’t imply any gender for the potential victim, it just happened the original poster is female.
If they have to post any statistics at all, it should only be about the criminal, which they did but with a Google AMP link grrrrrrr
There are shittons of rape & murder fantasy communities with secretly taken & stolen pictures on porn & snuff websites, on the snuff websites there’s unfortunately also real stuff.
This is something I really didn’t want to know. I wouldn’t want to walk in the shoes of my gf honestly just judging from the amount of harassment she faces in liberal, progressive western cities by men of all age & skin color (need to say this nowadays unfortunately). Add to that being physically inferior that creates a sense of being constantly threatened. Also, they are targeted specifically because they are women and femicide is a real, bad issue.
Not disagreeing that anyone could be affected, just saying I can easily walk at night because no one would target me specifically for being a man.
Clearly you’ve never been jumped lol. It’ll give you a whole new perspective on the world and walking around alone as a guy.
I find it gross that you referred to your own girlfriend as “physically inferior”. I think the better term is physically at a disadvantage.
Since you’re talking to a complete stranger on an anonymous platform it makes no sense to make any assumptions like that.
English is not my first language, in case that was an offensive formulation I apologize.
But your response definitely makes me question your intentions.
I apologizing for assuming. You said something along the lines of “nobody would jump be just because I’m a man” which tells me you haven’t been assaulted by random guys before in your life. They absolutely will jump you for no reason regardless of your gender. I posted those exact statistics in my first comment.
And the word “inferior” has a negative connotation connected to it. You usually use it to describe something that is worse in every way. For example: “I only use zip lock bags because other plastic resealable bag brands are all inferior”.
Your comment about your girlfriend taken at face value came across very sexist. Which is all we can do without knowing someone, how was I supposed to know English is your second language? You use better punctuation than me and it’s the only language I know lol.
no one would target me specifically for being a man
I think you’ve misunderstood. The commenter is not saying that random attacks don’t happen to men, that’s obviously true. But those attacks won’t target you specifically because you are male, which is an additional justification for violence that women have to deal with. I’d argue it’s even more common than women being targeted randomly - or even that random muggings/assaults are actually random. I mean, who’s jumping people that they think are a threat?
I blame women.
For not murdering enough. The streets would be safer if men had the same fear.
Men are killed more often. But men generally have less fear. We go boldly unto death.
That’s not being bold, that’s supression of risk assesment and reduction on consequence sensitivity. Brought on by testosterone.
who’s killing the men?
I blame women.
😡🍴
For not murdering enough
😮💨👍
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I mean, most women probably have experience with cleaning up blood.
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I wonder if that’s throwing off the statistics.
ive had 2 (and a half) nosebleeds this week, can confirm.
(I’m fine it’s just the dry+cold weather)Cold weather plus cocaine has that effect
I blame women.
For not murdering enough. The streets would be safer if men had the same fear.
Wow calling for the death of innocent people based on gender.
The fuck is wrong with Lemmy upvotng this.
its a joke fella.
I’m thinking more of a voluntary program.
That shadowm’n on her 1am walk is gonna go away quickly if I’m with her and she ices me right there in the Applebee’s parking-lot 🫠 she’s allowed to do it. It happens all the time…
Ah, misandry, my old friend.
Where is the mention of the victim’s gender in this meme? If there was a man in a picture, not a woman, do you think the text would be less true? Do you feel comfortable walking somewhere at night when some strange man starts walking up to you? I sure as hell don’t despite my possession of a penis.
I mean, if I were to throw out lines such as “if only women didn’t demand so much”, I’d be guilty of misogyny regardless of who I implied the demand was levied against.
The misandry here is “men love to commit murder”, not the implication of who is murdered.
Yes, if you divorce part of a sentence from the context in which it was placed, it does become bigoted.
I assume you don’t think this person means every time they have ever walked anywhere at night in their entire life when they talk about night walks, but you assume this person means every single man. It shouldn’t be necessary to have that explained to you.
Also, you don’t seem to understand the difference between punching up and punching down.
ah yes misandry is when women don’t just shut up and accept disproportionate violence from men
Misandry is where you see men as the problem - nothing more or less. It’s easy to quote stats, it’s much harder to address the real issues underneath.
On 196 they love pictures of women punching men. But post the opposite and instaban.
Edit: nevermind
Removed by mod
Violence is bad no matter what gender is doing what to whom. Is there a problem?
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