I’ve been using Ubuntu as my daily driver for a good few years now. Unfortunately I don’t like the direction they seem to be heading.
I’ve also just ordered a new computer, so it seems like the best time to change over. While I’m sure it will start a heated debate, what variant would people recommend?
I’m not after a bleeding edge, do it all yourself OS it will be my daily driver, so don’t want to have to get elbow deep in configs every 5 minutes. My default would be to go back to Debian. However, I know the steam deck is arch based. With steam developing proton so hard, is it worth the additional learning curve to change to arch, or something else?
It doesn’t really matter what distro you go with, just don’t go with something like Debian Stable because of how old their packages are. You don’t need a rolling release system, but you also don’t want something too old because of performance reasons.
If you are using flatpacks it would reduce the dependency on out of date system packages.
That’s fair.
Please stop spreading falsehoods.
Have you ever tested Debian stable vs Debian sid? You’ll notice a clear performance difference. Why? Because Debian Stable has older packages that don’t include performance related patches found in the newer ones. This is basic knowledge.
Newer = more feature & performance related patches at the cost of stability.
Older = Stability & downstreamed security patches. This is how releases cycles work.
Just look at it in terms of kernel version.
Debian Stable by default is at what? Kernel 6.1.0 now?
Arch is at kernel 6.6.3.
If you follow the Linux Kernel news you’d know that there’s pretty huge optimizations between these, some of which directly impact gaming on wine & proton.
Then there’s Mesa :
Debian Stable, Mesa 22.3.6
Arch Linux, Mesa 23.2.1
Huge performance patches between these.
(Elaborating now that I’m not on mobile…)
Yes, I have, as well as developed and packaged software for both. And not just a little. Your comment about how release cycles work is patronizing, and your diatribe is misleading.
Debian Stable currently has kernel 6.5 for those who choose to install it. Not that it matters, because a higher kernel version number doesn’t magically grant better performance. Specific changes may help in specific cases, but most kernel revisions don’t offer any significant difference to games. The more common reason to want a new rev is to support specific hardware.
Unless you have a very new GPU (released less than a year ago), your games are not likely to get any benefit at all from the latest kernel.
And unless your games require the very latest Vulkan features and you run them without Steam, Flatpak, or any other platform that provides its own Mesa, you’re not likely to get any benefit from a distro providing the latest version of it.
Practically everything else that games need is comparable across all the major distros, including Debian. (Arch might have hundreds of other packages that happen to be newer, but those won’t make games run faster.)
OP, choose a distro that makes you happy, not one that some random person claims is best for gaming. If what Debian offers is appealing to you, rest assured that it is generally excellent for gaming.
Bruv. I’ve packaged software for all 3 and beyond.
Which btw is completely irrelevant here so get off your high horse.
There’s clear performance differences between 6.1 and 6.6.3 Why? Because there’s several performance related patches & bug fixes that effect various APIs both Wine & Proton take advantage of.
Ofc, you can install newer kernels, you could install kernel 6.6.0 if you wanted, but you’d be going outside of the stable repo to do it which kinda defeats the entire purpose of Debian Stable. Not to mention that mixing and matching packages can lead to problems in the future. Like accidently using the wrong dkms driver version on the wrong kernel version, and other general compatibility issues.
I take it that you’re not active in the kernel development space, which is fine. However I personally am. Hell, there’s going to be even more of a noticable difference in kernel 6.7 thanks to FUTEX2 improvements.
As already stated, kernel 6.5 is available on Debian Stable.
No, it does not. Stable Backports exist for exactly this reason.
I don’t know how you might have managed to do those things, but no, installing the Stable Backports kernel would not cause either of them.
Please stop spreading falsehoods.
“Stable Backports” what a joke, Backports can and have destabilized user systems.
Let me just take the thing that’s not ready, configure it a bit differently and by some magic it’s “stable”, make it make sense.
At that point you have a semi-stable system, so… Ubuntu, PopOS, LMDE.
Even the Debian devs tell you to use the Backports with care.
Ignore reality, I don’t care. Go do it on someone else’s time.
Changing the subject away from Debian’s gaming performance is a strange tactic, but since you’ve shifted to mocking the name of the distribution, Debian Stable’s name comes from this sense of the word:
stable 3 of 3 adjective
1b : not changing or fluctuating : unvarying
I would expect someone so familiar with “all 3 and beyond” of the Debian distros to know that.
To indulge your sophistry, though, practically all operating systems have released broken packages at some point. Debian Stable has a well-earned reputation for doing it less than others. Even with kernel Backports. Trying to scare people away from it is a disservice to the community.
A question here: plan to upgrade to 7800xt sometime in the near future. The card is quite new, so i have doubts after your reply above. I am mainly gaming and do basic office stuff (Libre office is enough). Also, though I can install Ubuntu - press X to win type install works for me - I am new to linux, so not big on fiddling with obscure packages. Just want games to run well - so, in this specific usecase, what distros would you recommend to try?
That GPU is indeed new, and I don’t have one, but I think the amdgpu driver has supported it since kernel 6.4 or 6.5. Any distro offering that and recent AMD firmware will probably work. (You could also manually install the firmware files if you change your mind about fiddling and want a specific distro that hasn’t caught up yet.)
I don’t generally recommend specific distros, since people’s needs and preferences vary so widely. However, I would probably try Linux Mint (and the KDE Plasma desktop because I dislike Gtk) if I were in your position. Mint gets a lot of praise for being an easy distro based on the good parts of Ubuntu. It also maintains a Debian edition (LMDE), which I think is a good insurance policy in case Ubuntu ever goes off the rails and becomes unsuitable as a base for Mint.
If you find yourself struggling to choose, remember that you’re not married to whatever distro you try first. If you run into a problem that’s not easily solved, you can always switch.
Thank you, that helps.
The fiddling bit is not that i am particularly against, it just requires learning things that have no other use for me outside of playing a random game in my free time (so spending that valuable time on learning about OS internals instead of things i actually care about).You can call me a perfect user for windows - i just am tired of them trying to track me, changing their shit constantly and pushing their services within the product i paid for with my own money. Hence linux.
So what i am looking for is an out of the box experience that will not turn my eyes red.
For what it’s worth I have an RX 7900XT and it works great with the Free software driver. The other reply is right that amdgpu is supported. I use Endeavor and was a bit confused about setting it up at first, but the nice guys at the GamingOnLinux discord helped me out and now it’s extremely painless to use and upgrade.
Thanks! Can you walk me through here: what exactly is a Free software driver? As with everything in linux - you either know, or don’t)
It’s just what it sounds like: the driver is Free software. This is in contrast to the situation with Nvidia where there’s a Free software driver that doesn’t perform well and a proprietary driver from Nvidia that performs better, but is kind of a pain in the ass for users and distro maintainers to maintain. You’re reliant on Nvidia for support so you’re forced to use certain versions of kernels and libraries (I think). The AMD driver is free, open source, performs well and is more flexible.
Ah, so you mean the one supplied by AMD themselves? Good, thanks.