I would say intent really matters because a lot of times when people sort of step away from the issue in that way, it’s really just a thinly veiled way of espousing their beliefs without taking any blowback.
Could you elaborate on why you feel one or more of those statements is harmful? These sorts of statements were very helpful to me growing up, it was pivotal in realizing there wasnt something wrong with me, but rather i just needed to seek some extra instruction. Seems like the one on emotional regulation might be very helpful to you as well, as it seems to be limiting your ability to communicate here.
The word “Karen” has taken root in the last decade or so, describing a certain type of (generally female) personality. But why?
Well, that would likely be because it was a very popular name within a certain generation that also displays a fairly common set of behaviour among female members. The epitome of that behavior is one of privilege combined with victimhood.
But "Karen " isn’t a person, it’s a behavior model, and those “Karen’s” had kids (often plenty of them), and created subsequent generations that often learned similar behaviour.
These same people then twist concepts of feminism - which should mean equality - to mean superiority by:
Expecting been to be in touch with their partner’s feelings, but making the latter take precedent.
Expecting men to take on more traditionally “pink” work (cooking, cleaning, gardening etc) but not being involved in “blue” work (repairs, mowing the lawn, garbage, etc)
Expecting men to spend more time involved with the children but also expecting them to do all that other stuff that takes up time, while simultaneously paying less attention to they kids themselves (stuck to a phone with kids stuck to a screen)
–
This can include stuff like:
Getting upset because of stuff like “you haven’t taken me out to dinner in a long time” while ignoring the part where that’s because the credit card hasn’t been paid off since that “girls retreat” a month ago that “I totally needed and deserved”. Any argument to the contrary is not taking into consideration [female]'s feelings, worth, and hard work.
Killing a discussion about [male]'s worth and feelings with “well you did/do X and that makes me feel terrible” (even if X occured weeks/months/years ago, and never mind if things go beyond feelings and into domestic violence. A man is expected to take it and NEVER raise a hand, even in defence.
Equality has been killed by “if you can’t handle me at my worst, you don’t deserve me at my best”.
We don’t just see this reflected in relationships. Look at the crazies who will scream their entitlement at wait staff, or even police. Notice that the counter arguments become increasingly “I [don’t] deserve this treatment” while ignoring the behaviour leading to it. Girls literally choose not to learn cooking, sewing etc because they don’t want to be pigeon-holed into “traditional roles”
So we end up with people like this, whose entire outlook on life is based on what they believe they deserve, with nothing to say how they should act, and everything is always somebody else’s fault. Men just fall into one of those “somebody else” categories.
And boys that are raised under these same household? They see their fathers go from proud to beaten-down and often broke after divorce etc. Is it a wonder that many are now growing up to not want relationships or to start a family of their own? It’s terrifying.
Now I’m not going to say that this is all women. I’ve met great women and an proud to be friends with many who are intelligent, self-sufficient, and (hopefully) absent of most of the bullshit above. However, there are an increasing - and rather frightening - number who appear to subscribe to the above, attempting to find a man who “deserves” them (i.e be perfect) without looking at what they bring to the table other than a nice TikTok/Insta profile.
The reality is, a good relationship is a combination of the foundation you start with, what you put in, and sometimes a bit of luck. You need concrete and clean water on solid ground to start. That doesn’t work if one person is contributing just sand or water.
You don’t seem to be reading my comments, or perhaps you are conflating them with someone elses?
Firstly, I asked why the statements that I said are not sexist are harmful, I don’t think your statement answers that.
Second, the whole point of my initial post and the original post here, is that it isn’t biological differences, it’s social differences about how you are raised, how you were taught. Within a western context we all were sent to the same schools, the same playground experiences, the same movies and TV and the same daycares. Even if an individual escapes the socialization of one of these vectors, they are still exposed to all the others. that’s what’s under critique, not inherent truths about humanity. It’s important to introspect on these issues and seek to unlearn the parts that are harmful.
I also never even mentioned the word rapists in any of my comments, that seems like an entirely separate conversation entirely.
The concept that generalising statements are still applicable, even if they are not correct for every single person in the generalised group, is a bit complex, but if you sit down and think hard about it you might get it.
Caught me, I’m a self-hating man, definitely not a guy who is upset about societal standards applied to men giving us fucked tools for dealing with society in a civil manner.
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Men are bad at cleaning => sexist
Men are not taught as children to clean => not sexist
Men can’t emotionally regulate => sexist
Men are not socialized to emotionally regulate => not sexist
Women can’t change a tire => sexist
Women aren’t taught to change a tire => not sexist
Women are emotional => sexist
Women are taught to share their emotions => not sexist
There’s a big difference between making a statement about society and making a statement about humanity.
I would say intent really matters because a lot of times when people sort of step away from the issue in that way, it’s really just a thinly veiled way of espousing their beliefs without taking any blowback.
That I can certainly agree with, I guess I made that with the implicit assumption that they are made in good faith.
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Could you elaborate on why you feel one or more of those statements is harmful? These sorts of statements were very helpful to me growing up, it was pivotal in realizing there wasnt something wrong with me, but rather i just needed to seek some extra instruction. Seems like the one on emotional regulation might be very helpful to you as well, as it seems to be limiting your ability to communicate here.
I’ll take a shot:
The word “Karen” has taken root in the last decade or so, describing a certain type of (generally female) personality. But why?
Well, that would likely be because it was a very popular name within a certain generation that also displays a fairly common set of behaviour among female members. The epitome of that behavior is one of privilege combined with victimhood.
But "Karen " isn’t a person, it’s a behavior model, and those “Karen’s” had kids (often plenty of them), and created subsequent generations that often learned similar behaviour.
These same people then twist concepts of feminism - which should mean equality - to mean superiority by:
Expecting been to be in touch with their partner’s feelings, but making the latter take precedent.
Expecting men to take on more traditionally “pink” work (cooking, cleaning, gardening etc) but not being involved in “blue” work (repairs, mowing the lawn, garbage, etc)
Expecting men to spend more time involved with the children but also expecting them to do all that other stuff that takes up time, while simultaneously paying less attention to they kids themselves (stuck to a phone with kids stuck to a screen)
–
This can include stuff like:
Getting upset because of stuff like “you haven’t taken me out to dinner in a long time” while ignoring the part where that’s because the credit card hasn’t been paid off since that “girls retreat” a month ago that “I totally needed and deserved”. Any argument to the contrary is not taking into consideration [female]'s feelings, worth, and hard work.
Killing a discussion about [male]'s worth and feelings with “well you did/do X and that makes me feel terrible” (even if X occured weeks/months/years ago, and never mind if things go beyond feelings and into domestic violence. A man is expected to take it and NEVER raise a hand, even in defence.
Equality has been killed by “if you can’t handle me at my worst, you don’t deserve me at my best”.
We don’t just see this reflected in relationships. Look at the crazies who will scream their entitlement at wait staff, or even police. Notice that the counter arguments become increasingly “I [don’t] deserve this treatment” while ignoring the behaviour leading to it. Girls literally choose not to learn cooking, sewing etc because they don’t want to be pigeon-holed into “traditional roles”
So we end up with people like this, whose entire outlook on life is based on what they believe they deserve, with nothing to say how they should act, and everything is always somebody else’s fault. Men just fall into one of those “somebody else” categories.
And boys that are raised under these same household? They see their fathers go from proud to beaten-down and often broke after divorce etc. Is it a wonder that many are now growing up to not want relationships or to start a family of their own? It’s terrifying.
Now I’m not going to say that this is all women. I’ve met great women and an proud to be friends with many who are intelligent, self-sufficient, and (hopefully) absent of most of the bullshit above. However, there are an increasing - and rather frightening - number who appear to subscribe to the above, attempting to find a man who “deserves” them (i.e be perfect) without looking at what they bring to the table other than a nice TikTok/Insta profile.
The reality is, a good relationship is a combination of the foundation you start with, what you put in, and sometimes a bit of luck. You need concrete and clean water on solid ground to start. That doesn’t work if one person is contributing just sand or water.
Removed by mod
You don’t seem to be reading my comments, or perhaps you are conflating them with someone elses?
Firstly, I asked why the statements that I said are not sexist are harmful, I don’t think your statement answers that.
Second, the whole point of my initial post and the original post here, is that it isn’t biological differences, it’s social differences about how you are raised, how you were taught. Within a western context we all were sent to the same schools, the same playground experiences, the same movies and TV and the same daycares. Even if an individual escapes the socialization of one of these vectors, they are still exposed to all the others. that’s what’s under critique, not inherent truths about humanity. It’s important to introspect on these issues and seek to unlearn the parts that are harmful.
I also never even mentioned the word rapists in any of my comments, that seems like an entirely separate conversation entirely.
The concept that generalising statements are still applicable, even if they are not correct for every single person in the generalised group, is a bit complex, but if you sit down and think hard about it you might get it.
Removed by mod
Caught me, I’m a self-hating man, definitely not a guy who is upset about societal standards applied to men giving us fucked tools for dealing with society in a civil manner.
Removed by mod